A question about rights.

[commanderawesome]

Oh. I thought you could convert models, like from Jedi Academy. That's fine.

we can only convert things that were released as assets to the community. the RC models were ripped.(source)

Does this mean one can convert from SWBF?

[THEWULFMAN]

You mean convert from SWBF to other games?

Or from SWBF1 to SWBF2?

[commanderawesome]

You mean convert from SWBF to other games?

Or from SWBF1 to SWBF2?

Either.

[THEWULFMAN]

SWBF1 to SWBF2 has already been done several times over because the art assets use the same formats.

As for SWBF2 to other games, I don't see why not. So go ahead, or don't. I'm a modder, not a cop.

[Teancum]

We're only concerned with mods that people release here on Gametoast. So if a mod -- regardless of what game it's for -- were released with illegal model conversions (we allow Star Wars <--> Star Wars conversions) we have a responsibility to block it from the site so Guru doesn't get a Cease and Decist order. As for other sites, WULF said it best.

There is the aspect of Fair Use Copyright Law in the United States (where this server resides) which basically states that minimal use of copyrighted material is permissible in certain circumstances (one of which is that the usage is free of cost... I.E. a mod). We try to follow that.

[Twilight_Warrior]

http://xkcd.com/859/

Where is your context now? -Staff

[KeepAmazinn]

We're only concerned with mods that people release here on Gametoast. So if a mod -- regardless of what game it's for -- were released with illegal model conversions (we allow Star Wars <--> Star Wars conversions) we have a responsibility to block it from the site so Guru doesn't get a Cease and Decist order. As for other sites, WULF said it best.

There is the aspect of Fair Use Copyright Law in the United States (where this server resides) which basically states that minimal use of copyrighted material is permissible in certain circumstances (one of which is that the usage is free of cost... I.E. a mod). We try to follow that.

If this is true then why for instance is ripping republic commando models frowned upon? It's a decade old game and the studio (lucasarts) no longer exsists. As long as mod is non profit there should be no problem right?

[THEWULFMAN]

Because it's ripping them, the assets weren't released to the public. It's still a legal issue this site doesn't want to deal with.

[Teancum]

We're only concerned with mods that people release here on Gametoast. So if a mod -- regardless of what game it's for -- were released with illegal model conversions (we allow Star Wars <--> Star Wars conversions) we have a responsibility to block it from the site so Guru doesn't get a Cease and Decist order. As for other sites, WULF said it best.

There is the aspect of Fair Use Copyright Law in the United States (where this server resides) which basically states that minimal use of copyrighted material is permissible in certain circumstances (one of which is that the usage is free of cost... I.E. a mod). We try to follow that.

If this is true then why for instance is ripping republic commando models frowned upon? It's a decade old game and the studio (lucasarts) no longer exsists. As long as mod is non profit there should be no problem right?

Depends on what you rip. If we're talking one character or gun model then that would fall under Fair Use. Most people think they can use a ton of stuff. That's breaking US copyright law.

[commanderawesome]

We're only concerned with mods that people release here on Gametoast. So if a mod -- regardless of what game it's for -- were released with illegal model conversions (we allow Star Wars <--> Star Wars conversions) we have a responsibility to block it from the site so Guru doesn't get a Cease and Decist order. As for other sites, WULF said it best.

There is the aspect of Fair Use Copyright Law in the United States (where this server resides) which basically states that minimal use of copyrighted material is permissible in certain circumstances (one of which is that the usage is free of cost... I.E. a mod). We try to follow that.

I'm just talking about Battlefront series --> Other star wars game, since you guys do Jedi Knight Series --> Battlefront 2. (like Kyle Katarn in the Convo Pack, for example) I'm sorry for the confusion this has caused. More specifically, there are some assets available for Empire at War taken from Battlefront, and I wanted to check with you guys (and SWBFGamers), to see if it was right to use them. Again, I'm sorry that I didn't clarify.

[Anakin]

We're only concerned with mods that people release here on Gametoast. So if a mod -- regardless of what game it's for -- were released with illegal model conversions (we allow Star Wars <--> Star Wars conversions) we have a responsibility to block it from the site so Guru doesn't get a Cease and Decist order. As for other sites, WULF said it best.

There is the aspect of Fair Use Copyright Law in the United States (where this server resides) which basically states that minimal use of copyrighted material is permissible in certain circumstances (one of which is that the usage is free of cost... I.E. a mod). We try to follow that.

If this is true then why for instance is ripping republic commando models frowned upon? It's a decade old game and the studio (lucasarts) no longer exsists. As long as mod is non profit there should be no problem right?

Depends on what you rip. If we're talking one character or gun model then that would fall under Fair Use. Most people think they can use a ton of stuff. That's breaking US copyright law.

But after the Unreal Editor is released we can modify the whole SWRC game (textures for example, but also models, etc). Isn't this a kind of releasing the assets??

If i interpret KeepAmazinn's post right he means why we can not use the original RC models, for a era mod (just like my one). It has cleared in this thread a while ago.

And i realy can understand that most of you would like to see them released in a mod. But the stock RCs have an other body property, so they are stretched to fit to the SWBF II bones/animations. Also Nedarb's RC is on a good way to be better than the stock RC. We should be so fair to give him the time he needs to finish his project.

[THEWULFMAN]

Not even in the same ballpark, Anakin. Just because you have the tools to extract the assets using the Unreal Editor, doesn't mean LucasArts suddenly gave you permission to use their assets.

[KeepAmazinn]

Under fair use as long as you give credit to the original source, not pass the work (for this case the model) as your own, and not make any profit of said project then you are in the clear. Now considering the rights to starwars for the pc and console market has been given to EA, I wouldn't advise ripping any model from any star wars game current or older. Unless the source material or modding tools has been released previously. EA as ruthless as they are can give you a cease and desist for these next ten years due to the contract they signed with Disney. But if this topic was brought up say a couple years ago then I would see no problem with using models from a decade old game.

To give an example would be the team currently making a halo game in the unreal engine. Microsoft has every right to give a cease and desist but they haven't due the team stating this game will be non profit and wouldn't take any attention away from the main halo games. Not to bash gametoast (I love all you guys) but a mod for star wars battlefront 2 hosted by this site, regardless of how good it is wouldn't attract the kind of attention needed for a multi-million dollar corporation to take notice.

If you decide to rip models, animations, music, sounds ect. then I advise caution because of the fact a cease and desist can happen. But that choice is up to the mod developer. Hope this clears anything up for people still wondering why people are weary on ripping models.

[commanderawesome]

SWBF1 to SWBF2 has already been done several times over because the art assets use the same formats.

As for SWBF2 to other games, I don't see why not. So go ahead, or don't. I'm a modder, not a cop.

For other non profit projects, i guess so. I don't see why though, they are so low poly.

I am no authority on this and do not claim to know about the laws surrounding this.

Technically,yes, I believe, as they were released in the Pandemic assets. Republic Commando models, on the other hand, were converted from the source files and not from assets.

This may be helpful as well: http://www.swbfgamers.com/index.php?topic=7154.0
Tirpider gives some good reasoning here.

I have to agree with MileHighGuy, though, they're way too low poly to even be worth it.
Converting assets tends to be a tedious work, and you might as well just spend time creating new assets better suited (and more legal) for your work.

We're only concerned with mods that people release here on Gametoast. So if a mod -- regardless of what game it's for -- were released with illegal model conversions (we allow Star Wars <--> Star Wars conversions) we have a responsibility to block it from the site so Guru doesn't get a Cease and Decist order. As for other sites, WULF said it best.

There is the aspect of Fair Use Copyright Law in the United States (where this server resides) which basically states that minimal use of copyrighted material is permissible in certain circumstances (one of which is that the usage is free of cost... I.E. a mod). We try to follow that.

If this is true then why for instance is ripping republic commando models frowned upon? It's a decade old game and the studio (lucasarts) no longer exsists. As long as mod is non profit there should be no problem right?

Depends on what you rip. If we're talking one character or gun model then that would fall under Fair Use. Most people think they can use a ton of stuff. That's breaking US copyright law.

But after the Unreal Editor is released we can modify the whole SWRC game (textures for example, but also models, etc). Isn't this a kind of releasing the assets??

If i interpret KeepAmazinn's post right he means why we can not use the original RC models, for a era mod (just like my one). It has cleared in this thread a while ago.

And i realy can understand that most of you would like to see them released in a mod. But the stock RCs have an other body property, so they are stretched to fit to the SWBF II bones/animations. Also Nedarb's RC is on a good way to be better than the stock RC. We should be so fair to give him the time he needs to finish his project.

Not even in the same ballpark, Anakin. Just because you have the tools to extract the assets using the Unreal Editor, doesn't mean LucasArts suddenly gave you permission to use their assets.

Under fair use as long as you give credit to the original source, not pass the work (for this case the model) as your own, and not make any profit of said project then you are in the clear. Now considering the rights to starwars for the pc and console market has been given to EA, I wouldn't advise ripping any model from any star wars game current or older. Unless the source material or modding tools has been released previously. EA as ruthless as they are can give you a cease and desist for these next ten years due to the contract they signed with Disney. But if this topic was brought up say a couple years ago then I would see no problem with using models from a decade old game.

To give an example would be the team currently making a halo game in the unreal engine. Microsoft has every right to give a cease and desist but they haven't due the team stating this game will be non profit and wouldn't take any attention away from the main halo games. Not to bash gametoast (I love all you guys) but a mod for star wars battlefront 2 hosted by this site, regardless of how good it is wouldn't attract the kind of attention needed for a multi-million dollar corporation to take notice.

If you decide to rip models, animations, music, sounds ect. then I advise caution because of the fact a cease and desist can happen. But that choice is up to the mod developer. Hope this clears anything up for people still wondering why people are weary on ripping models.

(Source of additional quotes)
I guess i'll just be careful, then. Only using converted assets if there's no other option then making it myself (i'm no modeler), and even then, i'll try to get them replaced ASAP. Thanks for the support, guys.