Windows 7 is awful

[Twilight_Warrior]

I have hopes for windows 9

Nah, Windows 10 is where it's at, because it's likely it will be called Windows X (roman numeral 10, for those slower than others), then they'll make a professional version and want to name it Windows XP (X Professional), but since they already used that, they will call it Windows XP2, AND THEN they'll realize how awesome XP was and try to incorporate as much of the XP goodness in as possible.

But I digest...

[Teancum]

I think they should just call it Windows LEVELUP because they'll have enough XP in it by then.

[kinetosimpetus]

All mankind is divided into three groups: those that are immovable, those that are movable and those that move.

It is safe to say Microsoft is part of the "immovable" group of mankind.

[Post assumes Franklin is referring to invention/progress rather than persuasion.]

"immovable" because they won't go back to XP?
Maybe they are moving with Win7?
And haven't had a chance to move with it enough yet.
And the "immovables" are the ones that feel the need to stick with XP just 'cause Win7 is "different" rather than actually making a job more difficult for an otherwise "movable"?

[Master_Ben]

I just got 7 on my new home-built, and, just to throw out there, ZE and the mod tools work fine on this 64-bit, windows 7 professional setup. Thank god. I'm certainly not supporting 7 though. Heck, it won't even put my machine into sleep.

[redgroupclan]

Hopefully they have a good OS out by the time XP loses support.

Let's hope there's never a time where we can't play the games we love and own now because of new OS's. Do you think they would keep adding "band-aid fixes" that were spoken of earlier or would we be forced to throw out our old games?

[Maveritchell]

Hopefully they have a good OS out by the time XP loses support.

You know what? They do, actually - it's called Windows 7. It's been reviewed critically well, it's been popularly received well, and a lot of the whinging in this thread is just "yeah me too" to Tean's initial complaint. Frankly, I think there is probably a single Win XP power user in this thread, and that's Tean, since he's in a software development field. While I don't agree with his initial complaint, I can't argue it from a level playing field (not being a developer myself), and so I can at least accept the complaint. Everything else smacks of "I'm used to X and Y is different." You know what? Windows '95 was a lot to get used to after 3.0, but it wasn't a bad change. Windows XP was essentially identical to '95 and '98 from a regular-user standpoint, which means there wasn't a lot to get used to. Windows 7 is different from XP the same way '95 was from 3.0.

Change isn't bad. You are going to need to learn to move on, because change will keep coming. I think this thread can do a lot more than simply whine about change - if there are real issues, bring them up - maybe you can learn a thing or two about the new OS that helps you adapt to it better. Don't just complain, though. That doesn't really serve much purpose.

[VF501]

I find Windows7 to be perfectly fine in my experience, both as a Techie and Enduser.

I have gotten everything to work fine with minor or no bugs under Win7x64 as they did under WinXPx86, except for 2 programs.

One was Starcraft/SC Broodwar, which was solved using the TeamLiquid Chaos launcher.

The other was the original zeroedit from StarWars Battlefront 1, world rendering only produced whiteblocks. Zeroedit for SWBF2 works fine under Win7x64 for me.

XSI had the plugin problems but that was solved with a few commands in cmd. Only XSI issue is the DX9 related marquee selection transparency error, in which the interior of the selector is flat gray instead of transparent.

I've done my fair share of programing and troubleshooting on Win7 and find it no different than XP mostly. UAC is a pain but then it's less troublesome with Linux/UNIX security features. If I have to I resort to DOS commands to force through things I need. Major issue in 7 compared to Xp is the RAM usage when you get right down to it.

The biggest mistake MS is making at this point is to try and move most of their customer's computing to Cloud based LIVE services in a single Window/Xbox/WinPhone system. Looks good on paper, except for the fact of what happens when the system goes down? I also like to be the one in charge of the system and data that I use on a personal basis.


The evolution of Windows can actually be likened to Ubuntu Linux at this point. XP and earlier version of Ubuntu (6.1 and earlier) could be used on low spec machines quite well. After Vista and Ubuntu 7.04 required specs for both jumped dramatically. Win7s high specs comparatively are a side effect of using the same kernal as Vista, since Win7 is basically a fixed and trimmed down Vista.

You want bad OS' look at Vista and MacOSX. Vista was so bad the system couldn't even apply its own ServicePack1 update properly without serious workarounds that didn't always work.

MacOS9 was awesome, then for OSX they took everything that made OS9 good and dropped it. OSX is more restrictive, more bloated, way to obtuse on a technical level and can screw up more than OS9 and WinXP and Win7 combined. As a point of reference OSX can do no more than WinXP or Win7 and yet it has way more lines of code dragging it down and causing problems. Considering OSX is built from UNIX Mach5 kernal it is quite an accomplishment for Apple to screw it up so bad.

(Following is estimates pulled from various sources)
http://www.engadget.com/2006/08/07/live ... s-keynote/
http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/2006/0 ... -code.html

OSX 86 million SLOC
WinXP 40 million SLOC
WinVista ~50 million SLOC

[501st_commander]

Hopefully they have a good OS out by the time XP loses support.

You know what? They do, actually - it's called Windows 7.

By the time Windows XP is gone, Windows 8 will be out (actually 2 years before). Thats suppose to be the best operating system, with a hole new BiOS. But for the time being, i agree with you Mav, 7 is best.

[THEWULFMAN]

Hopefully they have a good OS out by the time XP loses support.

You know what? They do, actually - it's called Windows 7. It's been reviewed critically well, it's been popularly received well, and a lot of the whinging in this thread is just "yeah me too" to Tean's initial complaint. Frankly, I think there is probably a single Win XP power user in this thread, and that's Tean, since he's in a software development field. While I don't agree with his initial complaint, I can't argue it from a level playing field (not being a developer myself), and so I can at least accept the complaint. Everything else smacks of "I'm used to X and Y is different." You know what? Windows '95 was a lot to get used to after 3.0, but it wasn't a bad change. Windows XP was essentially identical to '95 and '98 from a regular-user standpoint, which means there wasn't a lot to get used to. Windows 7 is different from XP the same way '95 was from 3.0.

Change isn't bad. You are going to need to learn to move on, because change will keep coming. I think this thread can do a lot more than simply whine about change - if there are real issues, bring them up - maybe you can learn a thing or two about the new OS that helps you adapt to it better. Don't just complain, though. That doesn't really serve much purpose.

While normally when it comes to things mav says i wholeheartingly concur, but in this case i dont.
I HAVE used Win7
Lots of the programs i use dont work.
And the interface just isnt right for me.

If you can use it, and like it Great, but let us have our own opinion.
And im not just saying "yeah me too"
alot of the things i use for school, and my programs refuse to work.
but in truth, i dont hate win7, but i do hate vista.
when the time comes, i will switch to win 7, but i still think they could have done better.

[Twilight_Warrior]

I HAVE used Win7

when the time comes, i will switch to win 7

Uhhhh... If you don't have it, yourself, and you haven't toyed around with it for long periods of time (days, weeks, months), how do you know that "alot of the programs you use don't work"? If you were just at a friend's house or something, that isn't NEARLY enough time to try *every* workaround possible.

I have both Win7 AND Vista. Win7's on my personal laptop and Vista's on our family desktop. All programs work fine, aside from SWBF2's audio-jumping issue, but I can get over that. Do some require a workaround? Yes (Kotor2's was a pain in the arsche, but I got it). Is this the first time workarounds have been necessary to get older programs to work on newer OS's? No (DOSBox anyone?).

Long story short: Program doesn't work?
"<insert name of program here> Windows 7" or "<insert name of program here> Windows Vista".
DISCLAIMER: you might have to include the specific problem such as "does not run" or "install fail".

If nothing shows up, then you are the ONLY person who has issues with Windows 7/Vista and that specific program, meaning it's most likely not the OS's fault. You MIGHT get a case where there is not a known fix, but I don't think there are many of those cases if the program was built to run in Windows XP. If you're trying to run a program that was made before XP, then yeah you're probably SOL.

PS:

Hidden/Spoiler:

I'm not sure "I wholeheartingly concur" is proper grammar/use of the word, as concur is not an EXACT synonym of agree.

[SilvaDalek]

All mankind is divided into three groups: those that are immovable, those that are movable and those that move.

It is safe to say Microsoft is part of the "immovable" group of mankind.

[Post assumes Franklin is referring to invention/progress rather than persuasion.]

"immovable" because they won't go back to XP?
Maybe they are moving with Win7?
And haven't had a chance to move with it enough yet.
And the "immovables" are the ones that feel the need to stick with XP just 'cause Win7 is "different" rather than actually making a job more difficult for an otherwise "movable"?

The quote is pretty obviously about human persuasion...I saw something about people wanting to email Microsoft about Windows, but since Microsoft is immovable they won't even remotely care.

[THEWULFMAN]

I'm not sure "I wholeheartingly concur" is proper grammar/use of the word, as concur is not an EXACT synonym of agree.

off topic much?
Its just something i say,
"I Concur :plokoon: "
You might have noticed, anyway,
I had to use a cp with WIN7 for awhile, my own pc has XP, most of the programs worked, but my biggest prob was the interface.
but I digress, I guess this is just another count of "THEWULFMAN's opinion doesnt matter"
So I will not say anything more here.

[redgroupclan]

I saw something about people wanting to email Microsoft about Windows, but since Microsoft is immovable they won't even remotely care.

There's power in numbers. With the right words and enough people, I'm sure Microsoft would do the smart thing.

[Darth_Squoobus]

I saw something about people wanting to email Microsoft about Windows, but since Microsoft is immovable they won't even remotely care.

There's power in numbers. With the right words and enough people, I'm sure Microsoft would do the smart thing.

Or not do anything and lose customers.

[Twilight_Warrior]

Hidden/Spoiler:

[quote="THEWULFMAN"][quote="Twilight_Warrior"]
I'm not sure "I wholeheartingly concur" is proper grammar/use of the word, as concur is not an EXACT synonym of agree.[/quote]

off topic much?
Its just something i say,
"I Concur :plokoon: "
You might have noticed[/quote]
I did notice, and just saying "I concur" is fine, but I don't think you can put an adverb in with it, it just doesn't sound right. Like saying "Halt the car!" instead of stop the car, while the words mean the same thing, it doesnt quite sound right.

I had to use a cp with WIN7 for awhile, my own pc has XP, most of the programs worked, but my biggest prob was the interface.
but I digress, I guess this is just another count of "THEWULFMAN's opinion doesnt matter"
So I will not say anything more here.

Your opinion does matter. But this is an open forum. Disagreements happen. You voiced your opinion, I used it to show mine. I'm sorry if it felt like an attack on you, but it was a point aimed towards the general "I hate new OS's cuz my programs don't work like they used to" population. Cuz there are alot of you in this topic =p.

[kinetosimpetus]

Oh yeah, that reminds me, XP pwns because it runs Modview. A small program similar to MshViewer that is necessary for me to make lightsaber hilts for JKA. Except it doesn't even run on all XP computers. [/slight sarcasm] For everything else though, Vista/Win7 has worked fine for me, the toughest part is getting used to the changes, after that, Vista seemed normal, and computers with XP seemed odd. Now 7 seems a little different than Vista, not totally different from XP, so the transition has been fairly easy.

[Teancum]

I HAVE used Win7

when the time comes, i will switch to win 7

Uhhhh... If you don't have it, yourself, and you haven't toyed around with it for long periods of time (days, weeks, months), how do you know that "alot of the programs you use don't work"? If you were just at a friend's house or something, that isn't NEARLY enough time to try *every* workaround possible.

The point is that you shouldn't have to have workarounds. besides, are you denying the fact that there are a lot of applications that don't work well with Win7?

Again, it's a matter of 1) taste and 2) whether it programatically suits your needs. Win7 does neither for me. But for some people it does. Incidentally I got my new machine back with XP on it. It's soooooo fast now!